MK3 HDi Tuning

[Seaman]

Hi,
Does anybody have any knowledge or experience of HDi tuning?
On doing a trawl on the web of things Berlingo we came across the following:
http://www.chipexpress.com/products/288/
OK this particular page deals specifically with the '110' but it also has links to the '75' and '90' - our HDI engines.
The increase in power isn't absolutely necessary but the increase in torque certainly is beneficial and would produce a much more lively vehicle for overtaking and driving on rural minor roads requiring much less stirring of the gear lever.
This approach would appear to have a lot more going for it than rechipping the ECU which can have extremely detrimental effects as well as certainly voiding the warranty and perhaps the insurance.
Best wishes,
Jim & Tracey

[andy b]

have a look on ebay they have plug and play boxes there 90 pound and there good i have herd

[happyhigh]

The unit mentioned in the original post looks interesting, I like the sound of its plug and play nature, and also the easy ability to return to factory original settings. Also the performance increases combined with the stated fuel economy cant be bad? Has anyone out there any experience with them?

[Northman]

This approach would appear to have a lot more going for it than rechipping the ECU which can have extremely detrimental effects as well as certainly voiding the warranty and perhaps the insurance.

I suspect that this approach will probably have as many detrimental effects as remapping the ECU, and I suspect that it will also void the warranty and (if you don't tell your insurance company) the insurance as well.

Note: On the question of detrimental effects, I have no expertise.

On the question of warranty and insurance, you'll need to speak to Citroen UK and to your insurance company. I'm pretty sure that your insurance company will not only regard this as a modification, but increase your premium substantially should you tell them that you intend to proceed with it.

[Ol'Jeffers]

On the question of warranty and insurance, you'll need to speak to Citroen UK and to your insurance company. I'm pretty sure that your insurance company will not only regard this as a modification, but increase your premium substantially should you tell them that you intend to proceed with it.

Also if the engine produces more power, by whatever means, the stated emissions will change you'll find yourself in a different vehicle tax bracket.

Really the only detrimental effect of re-mapping an ECU to give an engine more power, within reason, is that servicing becomes more crucially important, especially with respect to lubrication.
Oil changes should be carried out more often and oil specs. should be religiously observed.

My tame Citroen trained engineer who now carries out re-mapping and anything electronic- based told me that the 1.6l HDi can be mapped to give around 122bhp but there isn't any point taking it that far on a Berlingo as the rest of the vehicle's characteristics aren't suited to that level of performance without substantial further modification, 100mph is as fast as you really want to go in a Mk.2 (which was the subject of our conversation.), although I appreciate that top speed is not the OP's problem and that he has the latest model.

I am, however, tempted to ask why he didn't buy a 110 initially

[Daivanman]

from looking at the link i would love to test the product to see if the claims of better economy actually are true? a little bit more power wouldnt go amiss as you say, but at 500 quid, is a tad pricey!!! What i would also like to know is, if there are actually any differences in the make-up of the engines as in between say a 2.0hdi 90 and 110, are they the same engine with different mapped ecu's?

[Ol'Jeffers]

Yes, they do work!
You will see that they carry ISO9001 and TuV approval amongst others. The Germans won't approve anything that is dubious. If you don't like what the end result brings, you have a couple of weeks to return it anyway.
If your thinking about getting one do it soon as I can see this removable module form of tuning becoming illegal to sell, by reason of increased emission and insurance anomalies.
They've been available for motorcycles for some years (Power Commander).

[800HDI]

Had a plug and play tuning box on my astra 1.7cdti. Waste of cash. It could be set at different so called power settings, when cranked upto the higher settings when you booted it the engine would go into safe mode and the warning light for the emissions would come on.

All i reckon they do is trick the ECU into putting more fuel into the engine hoping it will burn and as the exhaust smoke was also increased then thats all it was doing, but wasn't burning it.

Never saw any increase in MPG and was only a tiny gain in acceleration when travelling at motorway speeds.

The proper way is to have a proper remap done on a rolling road i think

[Northman]

What i would also like to know is, if there are actually any differences in the make-up of the engines as in between say a 2.0hdi 90 and 110, are they the same engine with different mapped ecu's?

I don't know. However, if you look at Seaman's link, you will see that the maximum power for the 1.6 HDi 110 engine is 150 PS. If you look at the page for the 1.6 HDI 90 engine, you will see that the figure they give for maximum power is 127 PS. That suggests to me that they probably are not just the same engine with differently mapped ECUs. In other words, they may be basically the same engine - but if they were exactly the same engine but with differently mapped ECUs, I would expect that the maximum power would be the same for both.

The proper way is to have a proper remap done on a rolling road i think

Again, I have no expertise on this subject. However, I did look into it a bit myself a few months ago. The conclusions that I came to were that if you were going to get something done, a proper remap by a reputable company like Superchips or Upsolute would be the way to go.

However, I could find absolutely no independent research on the effect of remaps anywhere on the web. All I could find were the confident assurances of the remapping companies. And there were a few voices out there who seem to have some knowledge of engineering, and who are sceptical. See, for example, the contributions of "unthrottled" on this thread: http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/i...tm?t=89077

[Guanajuato]

I don't know. However, if you look at Seaman's link, you will see that the maximum power for the 1.6 HDi 110 engine is 150 PS. If you look at the page for the 1.6 HDI 90 engine, you will see that the figure they give for maximum power is 127 PS. That suggests to me that they probably are not just the same engine with differently mapped ECUs.

Not that clever. Basically, they add 40% to the base power. 127~90x1.4, 150~110x1.4. Doesn't mean the engine is really any different. I suspect the main difference is mapping &/or turbo pressure.
That doesn't fill me with confidence that they do tailor them to each engine.