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[Engine] Catalyst? was: 1.4i Plug lead sequence?
#1
Hi!

I have a 1999 Multispace that is suffering in the engine department...

The original engine died last year(peanut butter in radiator, weird happenings elesewhere), so I got hold of a slightly older replacement from a breakers yard.

The problem is that the original engine had Sagem ECU, sagem Injectora and a coil cassette across the spark plugs, but the replacement has Magneti Marelli ECU, Weber IW155 injectors and was set up for a BOSCH coilsystem and individual plug leads.
Unfortunately, the BOSCH unit wasn't on the engine, and the two plug leads that were still on the engine were a mess.

I first tried to fit the SAGEM ECU and coil cassette to the replacement engine, but no go.
Possibly not compatible with the injectors, or possibly defect ECU.
I can't replace the injectors without replacing the top of the engine as they're differently shaped.
(And anyways, one contact says that the Webers are way superior to the Sagems)

Anyways, the engine is in the car, the wiring loom is 'fixed'(lacked the connector for the dump valve, and different connector on the hall-effect sensor by the flywheel), a replacement Bosch unit ha been sourced, new plug leads mounted and so on...

Except...
I don't really want to try starting it before I know the leads are in the right order.
I've looked in the appropriate section of the Haynes manual, but that only advised to 'take note' of the order when removing them.

Assuming that Cylinder 1 is the closest to the coil, I get something like this:
[]
14
23

The [] indicates the connector for the wiring loom.

Am I very far off?
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#2
My engine is still buggered...
But since my vacation just started, I finally have time to throw spanners at it...

Picture of engine...
[Image: FILE0002.JPG]
No, those aren't Citroën-issued plug leads. They're 'sport' quality leads.

http://www.totallytrygve.com/berlingo/FILE0003.MOV
(.MOV video recorded with an action-cam. It's supposed to show the screen of my netBook running LEXIA3 as I do a couple of starts.)

http://www.totallytrygve.com/berlingo/FILE0004.MOV
(Also LEXIA3, this time showing info about injectors during a start)

http://www.totallytrygve.com/berlingo/FILE0005.MOV
(Pressure-gauge connected to the Schrader valve on the High-pressure rail over the fuel injectors)

So...
I can see that the sensors registers changes in airflow, the movement of the throttle, stepping of the servo, even the voltage measured over the Lambda sensor.
The gauge shows over 3 Bar pressure before start, drops a little as I start it, then it climbs again as it limps along.
There's no error codes in the ECU.
I got hold of another set of IW155 injectors, but same behaviour with that, too.

Does anyone have any idea what can be wrong?
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#3
Firing order of a straight-4 engine will either be 1342 or 1243...
Berlingo Multispace 2.0HDI '54 reg Mediterranean Blue
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#4
Yes, I know that...

The problem is that there's no oldfashioned rotating distributor. The connections on the 'coil' unit may be laid out for ease of cable placement, not in a circular pattern for the firing sequence.
Also, I believe it's using what's known as a 'wasted spark' sequence, where two plugs fire at the same time. (one of the sparks is wasted as it's in an empty cylinder. Just as on the more modern version of the engine with the coil cassette directly over the plugs)

Combine the 'wasted spark' with the fact that the ECU activates the injectors in pairs, also, and... you soon realise why I don't really want to experiment too much.
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#5
This is all I could find if it's any help.
Usually cyl.1 is at the cam belt end, but don't quote me. :thumbsup:
Also it sems you are right about the wasted spark, - 1 & 4 spark together and 2 & 3 do as well.

   

Found this as well, If you have a ohm meter of some kind you should be able to figure out the coil ht leads. Confusedalut:

   
2006 2.0hdi 600 with bench seat.  Cool
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#6
Well, that is a lot more that I have found anywhere else.
Where's that from?

It may seem as if the number 1 and 4 cylinder leads needs to be swapped around if that one is accurate.

Will test it tomorrow.
It's 22:45 here, and frankly, my neighbours don't like that ind of horrible sounds that late in the evening.
(I don't like it either... )

Fingers crossed!
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#7
(19-06-2013, 08:43 PM)Gadgetman Wrote:  Well, that is a lot more that I have found anywhere else.
Where's that from?

It may seem as if the number 1 and 4 cylinder leads needs to be swapped around if that one is accurate.

Will test it tomorrow.
It's 22:45 here, and frankly, my neighbours don't like that ind of horrible sounds that late in the evening.
(I don't like it either... )

Fingers crossed!

Have updated previous post with coil connections.:thumbsup:
2006 2.0hdi 600 with bench seat.  Cool
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#8
And that second sketch pretty much proved that it doesn't matter which way round the 1 and 4 leads are plugged in. *Sigh*
(Tried anyway... )

Managed to salvage the old number 2 and 3 leads that came with the engine, and replaced the shiny, new ones with those. Didn't make any difference.

Swapped out the brand new plugs(sooty, as can be expected) and reinstalled the set that came with the engine. No difference.
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#9
Have you compression tested the motor, and tried a different ignition module?
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#10
Tested it after I got it into the car. Was fine, with less than .5Bar different between the cylinders. Could do another test now, though.

Also done a 'cup of tea' test on the cooling system recently.
(Connected a pressure tester, pumped it up to 25psi, went in and made myself a good cup of tea, got back out to check that it still read 25psi)

Haven't tested the module or tried a different one(they're bl**dy expensive here), but...
I have a 'spark tester' that you hold against the leads to test for spark.
http://biltema.no/ProductImages/15/large/15-1372_l.jpg
Had one of my neighbours check each cable as I did 4 starts.
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